Episode 105
InTheKnow: General Conference Highlights
Bishop Julius C. Trimble is the Resident Bishop of the Indiana Area of the United Methodist Church.
Bishop Trimble has the personal mission to encourage all people with the love of Jesus Christ to rise to their highest potential. It is his commitment to his personal mission that led Bishop Trimble to create the “To Be Encouraged” Podcast along with co-host Rev.Dr. Brad Miller.
Bishop Trimble says, “I am compelled by Jesus to share with you an encouraging word or two about Jesus, theology, the Bible, the pandemic, the environment, racism, voting rights, human sexuality, and the state of the United Methodist Church.”
To Be Encouraged with Bishop Julius C. Trimble is to be published weekly and is available at www.tobeencouraged.com and all the podcast directories.
https://www.inumc.org/bishop/office-of-the-bishop/
Episode 105.
Title: Three Significant Takeaways from Post General Conference “InTheKnow” Session
Introduction:
In this episode of "To Be Encouraged," host Rev. 1Justin Kingston engages in a rich conversation with guests Rev. Russ Abel and Rev. Dr. Aleze Fulbright following the General Conference. The episode delves into pivotal changes and key discussions that emerged from the General Conference, offering valuable insights and reflections for listeners.
Takeaway 1: Embracing Inclusivity and Removing Barriers
- The removal of prohibitive language concerning LGBT individuals from the Book of Discipline marks a significant step toward inclusivity within the United Methodist Church.
- Changes in the ordination process now facilitate inclusivity, ensuring that sexuality no longer acts as a barrier to progression.
- The decision to allow same-sex marriages and empower pastors in selecting whom to marry underscores a more welcoming and accepting approach within the church.
Takeaway 2: Regionalization and Constitutional Amendments
- Regionalization emerged as a major topic during the General Conference, with discussions focusing on U.S.-centric matters and ministry context relevance.
- The upcoming vote on regionalization in the annual conference sessions in 2025 raises the importance of education and information sharing to guide decisions.
- The constitutional amendments process, involving all annual conferences submitting information for potential voting, highlights the comprehensive nature of decision-making within the church.
Takeaway 3: Communication, Consensus, and Decision-Making
- Guest speakers stress the significance of open communication with superintendents and congregational dialogue to navigate disagreements effectively.
- Seeking consensus and guidance from God remains a central theme in decision-making processes, guiding pastors and congregations through challenging discussions.
- The emphasis on supporting one another, remaining focused on serving the world's needs, and expressing gratitude underscores the importance of unity and shared purpose within the church.
Closing:
As the episode draws to a close, the profound implications of the General Conference decisions are reiterated, emphasizing the ongoing journey toward inclusivity, unity, and informed decision-making within the United Methodist Church. Listeners are encouraged to engage in open dialogues, seek consensus, and embrace a spirit of inclusivity and understanding as the church moves forward in its evolving landscape.
Rev. Russ Abel Email:ds.eastdistrict@inumc.org
Rev. Dr. Aleze Fulbright central.district@inumc.org
Transcript
Make sure we're getting live here on Facebook.
Speaker:For those of you who are in the webinar now, I think C, there's 86
Speaker:of you, 87. That's a lot. Hey. Welcome to our conversation
Speaker:regarding the, the general conference, the 2024 post or 2020
Speaker:postponed general conference that just happened over the last couple weeks in Charlotte. I
Speaker:am Justin Kingston. All I get is pastor of Monticello United Methodist Church. I'm
Speaker:gonna be your host for today answering or trying to make sure your questions get
Speaker:asked. I I hope not to have to answer any of them personally.
Speaker:But I'll be asking your questions if you post those. Here in the Zoom
Speaker:webinar, you can post those in the q and a section. You can pop a
Speaker:question in, and I'll ask those at the appropriate times for each topic. If you're
Speaker:on Facebook live, you can also, go
Speaker:ahead and and post on there, and then we'll be able to
Speaker:to answer those questions as well. So let me make sure that we're live
Speaker:streaming okay.
Speaker:And, while I'm doing that, doctor, Fulbright and Russ, why don't you guys introduce
Speaker:yourselves as well? We'll be glad
Speaker:to. Doctor Fulbright, would you like to go first?
Speaker:Greetings, everyone. My name is reverend doctor Elise Fulbright,
Speaker:clergy, delegate to the postponed 2020
Speaker:general conference. So grateful to see our numbers are increasing.
Speaker:There are over 300 and almost 20 of you. My word.
Speaker:No pressure.
Speaker:Well, thank you, Elise. I'm Russ Abel. I'm also a clergy delegate
Speaker:to, the the general conference that just ended a couple of
Speaker:days ago. We're so glad for you to join us, and we,
Speaker:we're appreciative. Those of you who are migrating over from another call, thanks for
Speaker:your endurance, and, we're really glad you're here. So,
Speaker:Justin, we're also glad you're here. Hey. Thanks,
Speaker:Aiden. Thank you. I'm happy to be here with
Speaker:you all as well. So just full disclosure for everyone out there,
Speaker:this is a conversation with Elise and Russ, and
Speaker:Justin's here as well. But this is not the official stance of the I and
Speaker:UMC, of the UMC, the GMC,
Speaker:the GMWGC, ACDC. We don't think or anybody
Speaker:else except for Elise and Russ. That that a fair
Speaker:statement for you all? I I think that's a fair statement, Justin.
Speaker:I would wanna make the disclaimer. We did not check with ACDC, but we
Speaker:assume we're not the official stand support. We sent them an email, but they have
Speaker:not responded yet. So that's kinda where we are at this point. Even
Speaker:in DMC, we're not. Run DMC. Yeah. That's that's a good
Speaker:one. Let's put it all out there.
Speaker:So, a lot of things happened at general conference, and we're still
Speaker:trying to I I think it's fair to say we're not even sure exactly what
Speaker:all happened at GC because things have to go through lots of different protocols and
Speaker:that kind of stuff. But hot topic issues. The first one that I think we
Speaker:should talk about, regionalization. What what
Speaker:does it mean? What is it? What actually happened?
Speaker:Who wants a bad leadoff? Yeah. So thank you, Justin.
Speaker:So why I want to share that during our time today, we are
Speaker:just going to be able to provide the high level
Speaker:matters that have become worldwide news related to The United
Speaker:Methodist Church. We will not have time to delve
Speaker:deeply into all the actions of over 650
Speaker:petitions that were voted upon at this
Speaker:postponed 2020 general conference. We will be very
Speaker:succinct, and we will be concise in this 30 minutes
Speaker:to be able to provide you with just the high levels. I imagine
Speaker:that within the districts, there will be opportunities to be
Speaker:able to have these conversations more in-depthly, and the
Speaker:cabinet is meeting this week to be able to provide more direction
Speaker:for how we can best communicate, working with our dynamic
Speaker:communications team to ensure that you are informed and
Speaker:being asked of all the actions of this postponed 2020
Speaker:General Conference. Additionally, one of the
Speaker:major matters that did pass at the
Speaker:postponed 2020 General Conference was regionalization.
Speaker:If you'll remember, when we started these conversations, regionalization
Speaker:became a great emphasis for us, understanding
Speaker:that with the possibility of regionalization, it will
Speaker:create opportunities for ministry to happen contextually
Speaker:and relevantly in the context of ministry across
Speaker:many regions because we are a worldwide entity.
Speaker:So there were specifically 8 petitions related to
Speaker:regionalization as a whole, one to create the US as a
Speaker:region and also to create regions across the
Speaker:central conferences, which is on continents and in in
Speaker:and in countries, throughout other parts of the world.
Speaker:And so those 8 petitions did pass. But what does that
Speaker:mean? Simply because it passed at
Speaker:general conference does not mean it goes into
Speaker:action immediately. The actions related to the
Speaker:regionalization, friends, had to deal with
Speaker:constitutional changes. Therefore,
Speaker:any constitutional change within the United Methodist
Speaker:Church has to go back to the annual
Speaker:conferences for ratification. We have talked
Speaker:about this quite a few times related to what ratification would
Speaker:mean. And the ratification means that in our
Speaker:annual conference session in 2025,
Speaker:We're not negating you coming to 2024. Come, register, all of
Speaker:that. But in 2025, that's
Speaker:when clergy and lay, members of the annual
Speaker:conference, will be able to lend their voice through
Speaker:vote on all the constitutional
Speaker:changes that will be taking place. So what we
Speaker:intend to do is this fall, we will have a series of town hall
Speaker:meetings to be able to educate and provide
Speaker:information for what these constitutional amendments will
Speaker:be so that when we come to annual conference session
Speaker:2025, you're informed, you're educated, and
Speaker:you're ready to lend your voice and vote to it.
Speaker:And ratification is a aggregate vote. So it's not,
Speaker:oh, Indiana passed it, and, oh, the
Speaker:Congo passed it. No. It is the collective,
Speaker:vote. Excuse me. The collective votes of all United Methodist
Speaker:annual conferences to be able to have
Speaker:a 2 thirds majority rat, ratification.
Speaker:So friends, simply because things have passed related to
Speaker:regionalization at general conference does not
Speaker:mean it will be Encouraged immediately, and it
Speaker:requires more communication, more information. And
Speaker:you if you are a lay member to annual conference and
Speaker:or a clergy member, will have opportunity to lend your voice
Speaker:through vote at our 2025 annual conference
Speaker:session. So some questions came in the chat. I think they're really
Speaker:quick for you, Elise. 1, so just a 100%.
Speaker:We are voting in 2025 on this, not 2024.
Speaker:We had the conversation, being able to really
Speaker:inform persons related to this matter of regionalization
Speaker:when our annual conference session is less than 4
Speaker:weeks away would be unfaithful, and it wouldn't be
Speaker:fair. There are so many means and
Speaker:parts of this regionalization plan that everyone needs to be
Speaker:aware of before you can just blindly offer your support
Speaker:for it. And so that's one of the things that we had talked about.
Speaker:There will be, hear me, some annual conferences
Speaker:across the connection that may incorporate this
Speaker:into this year's 2024 annual
Speaker:conference session. However, Indiana will
Speaker:not take that action until our annual conference
Speaker:session in 2025. Got it. So I
Speaker:think that was answered to that one.
Speaker:Context 1. Heard that. Okay. Make sure we got them all.
Speaker:If it is passed in 2025, when would it become effective? Is that something we
Speaker:can answer at this point? So, again, all of the
Speaker:annual conferences across the worldwide connection will
Speaker:have to go through this process of, being part of the
Speaker:ratification. And once all of the annual conference
Speaker:secretaries submit their information to the council of
Speaker:bishops, the council of bishops meet I'll tell you exactly
Speaker:when they meet. They would meet, in the fall of
Speaker:2025, potentially, and or it may be
Speaker:early 2026 to be able to
Speaker:constitute what that vote will be. So understand,
Speaker:constitutional amendments don't just happen overnight.
Speaker:They happen over time. And
Speaker:every person who is a lay member and clergy
Speaker:member of annual conferences have voice and vote
Speaker:in aggregate related to any constitutional changes.
Speaker:So that's one of the things that people get perhaps, misinformed
Speaker:about, And, we have an opportunity to help further
Speaker:educate us regarding our United Methodist polity and practices.
Speaker:And then there's, one more question here. With
Speaker:the can you give us a couple of examples of contextualization of ministry?
Speaker:Something specific. Mhmm. So one of the
Speaker:aspects is there will be a general book of discipline
Speaker:where there will be opportunities for the US and
Speaker:or other countries and continents to be able to apply
Speaker:the foundations of what we as United Methodists hold is
Speaker:true and being able to apply it in their
Speaker:context of ministry. Additionally, just like at this postponed
Speaker:2020 general conference, a lot of the matters that we
Speaker:were voting upon was were U. S. Centric
Speaker:specifically. And so in the era of regionalization,
Speaker:should it move to, implementation, we would
Speaker:not waste 12 days with those from
Speaker:other countries and continents being, holding them
Speaker:hostage, in my opinion, to vote on matters that is US
Speaker:centric. Like the pension plan. Like,
Speaker:the number of bishops within jurisdictions. Those types of
Speaker:things are irrelevant to a point to those that are
Speaker:serving in other countries and continents, but yet there
Speaker:was a robust debate and a lot of time spent
Speaker:related to these matters that are specifically US centric.
Speaker:So is it I think it means it's safe to
Speaker:say, I'm not sure, that Indiana clergy have to wait to see if our annual
Speaker:conference ratifies anything versus just going off of the general conference said or suggests. And
Speaker:the reality is, and I think I can answer this one maybe, Elyse, is that
Speaker:general conference has approved it, but it has to be ratified. And that
Speaker:process will take a long time because every annual conference has to vote.
Speaker:We are voting in 2025, so we will not know until at least after our
Speaker:vote if that's passed or not. Is that a fair statement? We would not know
Speaker:until all of the annual conferences have completed the process
Speaker:towards ratification, which could be as early
Speaker:as the end of 2025 or as late as the middle
Speaker:of 2026. Got it.
Speaker:So I answered that one. And if you were posting questions and answers in
Speaker:here, that's great. Thank you so much. If we've already answered it,
Speaker:I am dismissing it. And I Encouraged you if you missed an answer,
Speaker:I'll try to tell you if you have, that you can go back and watch
Speaker:the recording. But because of the time crunch we have, I can't, go
Speaker:back and ask questions have already been answered. Okay? So I think we're going
Speaker:to our next And I'll just I'll also Encouraged. If your
Speaker:district is holding some type of informational or
Speaker:some type of seminar related to the matters of general conference,
Speaker:show up so that your questions can be adequately
Speaker:asked and answered. We're not dismissing anyone, but there is
Speaker:so much that could be shared. We want it
Speaker:to be faithful to be able to share the high level matters
Speaker:that really does potentially affect the local
Speaker:context of ministry. So thank you, Justin, for the work you're doing.
Speaker:No worries. Let's let's go with the easy one.
Speaker:Restrictive language, Russ. You wanna take that one? We will talk about that.
Speaker:Why? Sure, Justin. Let me just jump
Speaker:into that. But before I do, let me just say,
Speaker:general conference was pretty wonderful. There was a wonderful
Speaker:spirit there. The worship was incredible. We even
Speaker:had kind of a Pentecost moment at one point, where
Speaker:people were dancing in the aisles, including bishops. It was just a beautiful thing
Speaker:in so many different places. And and you get again, with general
Speaker:conference, you just get to see the diversity of the church on
Speaker:display. Right? The whole proceedings, every plenary session being
Speaker:translated by 10 languages.
Speaker:It it it's just wonderful to see. So the the,
Speaker:restrictive language or the removal of harmful language, as we've
Speaker:been talking about, all of the
Speaker:prohibitive language in regard to LGBT folks
Speaker:in the book of discipline was removed by petition and
Speaker:action of the general conference. So,
Speaker:all of that's gone. The prohibitive language,
Speaker:like, homosexuality is incompatible with Christian teachings.
Speaker:So that's been removed from the book of discipline. There hasn't
Speaker:been Real quick question for you, sir. Is that immediate?
Speaker:That's, like, 3 questions I have. If you can answer that now, that'd be great.
Speaker:Glad to answer that. So, as anybody that
Speaker:knows me knows, I'm not great at short answers. So general
Speaker:conference legislation has all kinds of different times
Speaker:when it comes into effect. Generally, it's the
Speaker:January 1 of the year immediately following the general conference.
Speaker:As with ratification, it can be extended out after the ratification
Speaker:process. You can also attach to legislation
Speaker:a quicker effective date. And with these, pieces of
Speaker:legislation that removed the prohibited language, they took
Speaker:effect at the end of general conference.
Speaker:So they are in effect now.
Speaker:And what what some of the things that that means, Justin, I think it's really
Speaker:important. The first thing I would say
Speaker:is that no church has to change what they're
Speaker:doing. There there's there has been
Speaker:space provided for churches that want to, pastors that
Speaker:want to, make some changes.
Speaker:That can happen, and it's and consistent with the discipline now.
Speaker:But churches that don't want to, it is not imposed upon you.
Speaker:So, some things that that could happen,
Speaker:this means that sexuality is
Speaker:no longer, a criteria for ordination.
Speaker:It means that churches can host gay weddings and
Speaker:pastors can perform them. So it means
Speaker:we're a fully inclusive church, but it also
Speaker:means something else. Something that was really important connected to this that was
Speaker:also passed was the the reaffirmation
Speaker:of the pastor's right to choose whom they
Speaker:marry. Right? So we're all charged with,
Speaker:with discerning couples as they
Speaker:come to us on whether or not we'll do their wedding. You know,
Speaker:some couples, in the past, I know I have said no to some folks,
Speaker:who I just didn't feel like God was leading me to do that. And,
Speaker:and so that's still in effect, and in fact,
Speaker:reinforced, through this general conference. So,
Speaker:this is a big moment. Let's not let's not deny it. Right? So
Speaker:this this means that LGBT folks are,
Speaker:those restrictions that have been in place since 1972
Speaker:have now been lifted. But let's also be clear
Speaker:that it doesn't change the mission of The United Methodist Church. Right?
Speaker:We're still Jesus people. We're still, called to
Speaker:make disciples of Jesus Christ for the transformation of the world. That's our
Speaker:mission. What it means is that we've opened up a little
Speaker:bit, and we now can honor, our LGBT siblings
Speaker:and, and recognize that. So in a in a short
Speaker:sense, Justin, that's kind of what happened. I would
Speaker:also say that the votes were overwhelming. The
Speaker:votes were overwhelming for the removal of harmful language.
Speaker:So that's where we are right now. And
Speaker:what it how it will be lived out? That's a good question. How will this
Speaker:be lived out? That will become clear over time. Right?
Speaker:So we what we're bringing you are the decisions.
Speaker:We we don't know yet exactly how everything's gonna come into
Speaker:place. And so that will, kind of, we'll learn that
Speaker:together as we live into this and and as
Speaker:we continue to be the church.
Speaker:Awesome. So I have some some follow-up questions here that people are asking.
Speaker:Really? Yeah. I'm not trying to process.
Speaker:One is, I think they're kind of both in the same veins. Can the appointed
Speaker:pastor in charge decide if a same gender wedding were to be hosted
Speaker:on local church property? So how would that decision be made? Would it be a
Speaker:church decision or a pastor decision? And I know it's great. Doctor Lee's has
Speaker:muted herself to make sure that she did not have to answer that question.
Speaker:So that's a really important question, Justin, and one that was
Speaker:particularly brought to the floor at general conference.
Speaker:So, let's first understand
Speaker:that pastor and parish, preacher and congregation
Speaker:are a team. We serve God together, and so we discern
Speaker:together, and and we we seek to honor
Speaker:God with our decisions. The pastor
Speaker:is the person who is responsible for the spiritual life of
Speaker:the church, and that includes weddings and and
Speaker:functions like that. So there is a a paragraph in
Speaker:the book Bishop discipline, 2533, 2533,
Speaker:that specifically states that the church or
Speaker:the trustees can't make policies that inhibit the ministry
Speaker:of the pastor. So the pastor is the one
Speaker:who would decide. But, again,
Speaker:none of us work in a vacuum, and so we work with our
Speaker:our laity to make those kind of decisions.
Speaker:But in the end, the decision rests with the pastor.
Speaker:And, Elise, you wanna chime in on that one at all?
Speaker:I would also offer, it's no different than the
Speaker:building use policies that local churches have
Speaker:already incorporated, and I know many congregations
Speaker:that already have, facility use
Speaker:agreements and policies related to weddings incorporated.
Speaker:So this could be an opportunity for the trustees,
Speaker:which includes the pastor, to really begin discernment
Speaker:and decision making related to the building
Speaker:use, related to this particular matter
Speaker:specifically. But what I hear and what I agreed with,
Speaker:Russ, is this should not be a church fight
Speaker:related to this particular matter.
Speaker:Period. This is a part of your practices that you
Speaker:already have implemented within the local context of
Speaker:ministry. No different than safe sanctuary, no different than the
Speaker:other aspects of policy that you have already in place
Speaker:in local context of ministry. This is an
Speaker:opportunity to revisit these particular
Speaker:policies in concert with pastor
Speaker:to ensure that the congregation is able to move forward.
Speaker:So I have a question here, about the taking process.
Speaker:Will that be changing, and will it would be forbidden to
Speaker:inquire about incoming pastors' preferences on this issue, Either
Speaker:their personal sexual preferences or the their preferences
Speaker:towards this issue in particular. Yeah. So, Justin,
Speaker:that's kinda ties back to what I said earlier about living into
Speaker:things. So processes have to catch up with with decisions.
Speaker:Right? So we don't know exactly what the processes are gonna look like.
Speaker:You know, it certainly will become a conversation point.
Speaker:And so I how that will fit into the actual process of
Speaker:appointment making, I don't think any of us are clear yet.
Speaker:Got it. And, obviously, that's something that's gonna take some time to understand what that
Speaker:looks like. Before we move on to the next
Speaker:question, I wanna Jack can answer 2 real quick. 1, will
Speaker:be will there be will there be a booklet recapping general conference decisions emailed
Speaker:to churches or available for download at some point? So I
Speaker:I think that Elise has a resource that that she'd
Speaker:like to reference, I think, at this point. So,
Speaker:provided a resource that came from our
Speaker:United Methodist Communications team that just dropped today
Speaker:that gives, an overview of some
Speaker:of the high level decisions
Speaker:that were made at the postponed 2020 general conference. And I
Speaker:believe pastor Justin and his and or Noah is going to
Speaker:be able to either post that or have that available in
Speaker:this end. I imagine that our
Speaker:communicate communications team will again begin
Speaker:circulating information so that all will be well informed.
Speaker:And the entire scope of us being able to do this is so that you
Speaker:have facts and that you have accurate information.
Speaker:Because as I have been aware, even today, there is a
Speaker:circulation of false information and misinformation and
Speaker:misconceptions related to many of the matters that were
Speaker:discussed and decided upon at the postponed 2020 general conference.
Speaker:I posted that link in both the live stream and as an answer to the
Speaker:question that was posted. So if you if you need access to that, we can
Speaker:also send it out in an email as well. I'm sure it'll come out here
Speaker:soon in communications. Hey. Justin, I'd also like to just reiterate
Speaker:what Elise said earlier. Talk to
Speaker:your superintendent, or watch your newsletter
Speaker:for, town halls or that kind of meeting where
Speaker:we're gonna be continuing to talk about that. I know we have a couple coming
Speaker:up next Saturday in the east and northeast districts, and it's
Speaker:the it'll be able to be a little bit more of a conversation, and,
Speaker:we look forward to those opportunities to share, because this was a
Speaker:this was a historic this is an important general conference.
Speaker:But as with everything, context always helps. And,
Speaker:for for you to talk to a delegate or someone who is there, it just
Speaker:helps to know, like, exactly how was that and what was the
Speaker:atmosphere, what was the attitude as it happened.
Speaker:Just had a question come in. And I'm not sure at this I'm not
Speaker:sure if this is what they're asking, but it says what happens if the congregation
Speaker:is opposed to the removal of harmful language and does not want to follow the
Speaker:new decision? I realize that's not what was decided at GC is the question
Speaker:answered or the question's been asked there. Well, yeah, I I think I
Speaker:can speak to that. So because
Speaker:only prohibited language would because the only action was to
Speaker:remove prohibited language. Nothing is being forced on a church. So if a
Speaker:church makes that decision, hey, you know, we're thankful that people have a
Speaker:place and a church where they can go to be married as LGBT
Speaker:folks, but but we just don't feel like that's where we are. That's a
Speaker:decision that local church can make in conjunction with the pastor.
Speaker:So as I said, nothing's being imposed on people. And I think that's
Speaker:really important to understand. It's really a way you know, we talk a lot
Speaker:about decisions. And decisions, I guess, have to be
Speaker:made. But the the the the more important thing
Speaker:is consensus. How do we move forward together? And I think
Speaker:that the way this decision came about allows for
Speaker:consensus to build of, you know, we're gonna we're gonna respond to God in the
Speaker:way that God's leading us, and there's space within the United Methodist Church
Speaker:to do that. And if a pastor and a congregation disagree, that's a
Speaker:follow-up question that was just asked. What would your what would that answer be for
Speaker:me, Russ? Yeah. Easy easy to answer. You call the dean of the cabinet.
Speaker:That's the reverend doctor Elise Fulbright, and she can meet all
Speaker:conflicts in local no. I'm joking. That would
Speaker:be a time that would be a time to talk to superintendent.
Speaker:And, and I'll I I can guarantee you, this superintendent, the first thing
Speaker:we would do is we'd spend time praying together. And,
Speaker:let's let's listen for god.
Speaker:Got it. And then I think Go ahead. We're gonna
Speaker:move towards another question. And I think what Russ said
Speaker:needs to be stated and restated. The restricted language
Speaker:was removed, but there was no additional language
Speaker:added, which means that the United Methodist Church,
Speaker:since its inception in 1968, has always
Speaker:been this big tent, organization
Speaker:where there are persons with differing understandings,
Speaker:marrying cultures and theological positions that
Speaker:we have been together since 1968.
Speaker:So with the removal of the language does
Speaker:not change us continuing to be this big tent.
Speaker:So if your particular congregation does not necessarily
Speaker:align with the understanding
Speaker:of all persons. You still are able
Speaker:to do ministry contextually. That has
Speaker:not changed. Our love for Jesus Christ
Speaker:has not changed. The mandate of making
Speaker:disciples for Jesus Christ for the transformation of the world
Speaker:has not changed. There has simply been
Speaker:a redaction, a removal of language that has
Speaker:been restrictive for persons who are in ministry
Speaker:and even the ability to see Jesus within our
Speaker:context of the United Methodist Church. And I think that those who
Speaker:are unable to hear that, let's have a conversation
Speaker:without throwing translations and texts,
Speaker:but listening to what is being said, because I think that is
Speaker:key. I feel that there are far too many people in a uproar
Speaker:about something that they perhaps are not listening to what the
Speaker:actual decision was.
Speaker:So, there are lots of questions about a topic we're gonna get to in
Speaker:a second. Before we get to that topic, Russ, do do you wanna say
Speaker:anything about the revised principles? Yeah. So
Speaker:this is a big deal too. And let me say a disclaimer or
Speaker:a correction. Some of you who were in town halls with
Speaker:me, I gave you a bad answer about something, and I wanna clarify
Speaker:that now. Removal of harmful language, which is
Speaker:part of the revised social principles and the social principles themselves,
Speaker:they do not require ratification. In a couple of town
Speaker:halls, I said that. It was my mistake, and I apologize. So
Speaker:the revised social principles that passed,
Speaker:they did sort of 2 things. They they took the the ones we've
Speaker:had for for a very long time, and they,
Speaker:they made them more appropriate to today. They
Speaker:updated language. They also, condensed, which is not something
Speaker:United Methodists do very often, but they condensed something. So it's a little
Speaker:bit smaller than it has been. But it also and this is for
Speaker:me just in the key. I mentioned earlier the the simultaneous
Speaker:translations, 10 different languages, you know, at one Trimble.
Speaker:And, that's a sign that we're a diverse church, And
Speaker:there are a lot of United Methodist outside the United States.
Speaker:When the social principles were first written, that was not the
Speaker:case. And so it was written from a very US
Speaker:centric point of view. And so now it's more of a
Speaker:global point of view, honoring all voices, trying to do that
Speaker:in with equity and fairness. So, it it's that's a big
Speaker:deal, and I'm excited that that that that passed.
Speaker:Okay. So, surprisingly, there's not many questions
Speaker:on on that one. But Okay. So
Speaker:disaffiliation. There's been a couple questions about that. Some
Speaker:said that they were felt they were lead led to believe that they should wait
Speaker:to disaffiliate until this affiliate until after general conference if they felt that the general
Speaker:conference decision wasn't something they aligned with. Where does the church stand currently on
Speaker:this affiliation? Are there provisions for that? What does it look
Speaker:like? So as we all know, from the
Speaker:actions of the special call 2019 general conference that
Speaker:happened in Saint Louis, it created a new paragraph that
Speaker:we would live in for a season, paragraph
Speaker:2553, that gave the provisions for this affiliation.
Speaker:In that paragraph 2553, it specifically
Speaker:had a sunset date of December 31, 2023.
Speaker:That date has ended. There was legislation
Speaker:that came before the general conference. It went through
Speaker:legislative committee. It went to the floor in
Speaker:plenary, and it was voted down.
Speaker:Additionally, it was voted to remove paragraph
Speaker:2553 from the book of discipline.
Speaker:So let me say, as I have received emails today about
Speaker:promises made to wait for general conference, I'm not
Speaker:sure who you heard these promises from. However,
Speaker:we in the Indiana Annual Conference made no promises
Speaker:related to the matters of general conference. There was
Speaker:conversation related to let's wait and see what
Speaker:general conference would do related to all the matters that
Speaker:we have been discussing today. Wait and see what general
Speaker:conference would do. The General Conference has decided
Speaker:there are no exit paths out of The United Methodist
Speaker:Church. And so therefore, we get the
Speaker:opportunity to live as 1, the
Speaker:United Methodist Church that is full of diverse
Speaker:persons with differing understandings related to
Speaker:many theological matters. And as we move
Speaker:forward, we will have to commit to the mission of making
Speaker:disciples of Jesus Christ for the transformation of the world. So to be
Speaker:clear, this affiliation has ended. It is no
Speaker:longer part of our record as United Methodist, and there are
Speaker:no other paths out of the
Speaker:United Methodist Church.
Speaker:Okay. I, I have some quick fire ones. If I can just get those
Speaker:out of the way real quick before we go on to the next topic. Will
Speaker:there be a, postponed 2024 general conference? We know
Speaker:if that's gonna happen or not yet. There will not.
Speaker:So what we just finished will serve as the postponed
Speaker:2020 and the 2024 general conferences.
Speaker:Got it. Awesome. That was an easy one to answer.
Speaker:Can a district or annual conference refuse to allow a person from going
Speaker:through the process of coordination based on their sexuality?
Speaker:Based on the actions that were taken were taken at,
Speaker:general conference, The matter of
Speaker:sexuality is no longer a prohibitive means for
Speaker:persons moving toward through the process of candidate
Speaker:towards ordination.
Speaker:Okay. And then
Speaker:this is more of a a general question. But
Speaker:if a church pastor elects to not marry an LGBTQ couple,
Speaker:if the church the couple seeks legal counsel unless they take legal action,
Speaker:would the conference help? So I guess the question is asking her how would that
Speaker:work? But my understanding is this is not a rule
Speaker:the law currently in in the book is for protecting.
Speaker:I'm not sure what that question is asking directly, but I wanna make sure I
Speaker:asked it. Mhmm. If that makes sense to you.
Speaker:Let me let me just take a short run at that. So
Speaker:Elise and I, or any superintendent, hopefully, any
Speaker:pastor would would never give legal advice.
Speaker:Right? So we just don't know that area. What I what
Speaker:I will imagine is in the next couple of weeks,
Speaker:we will get legal advice on what that means and,
Speaker:share that as soon as we have it. But at this point, we don't have
Speaker:any any, any way to address that question.
Speaker:I would also offer that, Russ, you just said
Speaker:it. In the local context of ministry, even even now,
Speaker:I have persons, period, who asked me to go
Speaker:through the premarital counseling and
Speaker:invite me to preside at their weddings. And if I
Speaker:discern that I can't truly bless their union, I say
Speaker:no for any person. So what
Speaker:makes this matter any different than any other
Speaker:person who has asked me or any pastor to marry?
Speaker:The thing is, I believe, that this becomes and has been
Speaker:a hot button matter. But please understand,
Speaker:pastors make the decision regularly when being invited
Speaker:to do funerals and even weddings related
Speaker:to if they will lend their gifts and service to it. So this is no
Speaker:different, friends. None.
Speaker:I'm kinda giving some general answers here.
Speaker:There's a question about deacons. That's something that we're not gonna cover today
Speaker:as much to my knowledge because it's just a time crunch we have. We're supposed
Speaker:to be done in, like, 2 minutes anyway. But there was a change in deacons,
Speaker:and I'm sure that we'll discuss that more annual conference. Is that a fair statement?
Speaker:Yeah. I I can I can address it really quickly? Drop it. Let's
Speaker:talk about it. The primary thing that happened for Deakin's by action of the general
Speaker:conference that will take effect January 1,
Speaker:2025, is that they will receive Sacramento
Speaker:privilege regardless of their appointment. So it used to be that,
Speaker:Deacon had to request sacramental privilege, do communion,
Speaker:do baptisms, but by this change, they'll have that authority as a
Speaker:part of their ordination. Well, just a just a
Speaker:clarification, it's based on their ministry context.
Speaker:So that was the language that was incorporated. But, again,
Speaker:we'll live into it, and it'll be further communicated. Yeah. And I think
Speaker:this is that's a good example, Justin, of you know, we just need to move
Speaker:a little slowly. Right? Because we all pick up and and
Speaker:retain different parts of what happened. And so it's gonna take a
Speaker:little time to live into it. Thank thank you for that correction, Elise.
Speaker:And even the matter of life as local pastors, because I know that that became
Speaker:a buzz, related to what the action was or wasn't. And, again,
Speaker:those are the types of things that we, as a cabinet need to have a
Speaker:conversation around, and there needs to be more formal communications
Speaker:around it. And I imagine that as the districts begin
Speaker:gathering over the next several days or, next several weeks, we
Speaker:will be able to offer more information related to
Speaker:that. But one thing I know to be true, and I know Russ is gonna
Speaker:chime in on this, even Bishop Offord, our licensed local
Speaker:pastors are integral to the life and ministry within
Speaker:the Indiana Annual Conference. And so we value
Speaker:our licensed local pastors. And I know that it's hard to hear
Speaker:amidst the news buzz that came about from this general conference.
Speaker:But please know the actions of general conference didn't
Speaker:change anything related to the matters of being able
Speaker:to serve as licensed local pastors within the United
Speaker:Methodist Church. Yeah. And I I just
Speaker:add add my, you know, thumbs up to that. You know,
Speaker:we we treasure, and see as
Speaker:colleagues all of our licensed local pastors,
Speaker:and I would encourage you just to know this really quickly.
Speaker:Some of what you're hearing is not quite correct.
Speaker:The legislation regarding local pastors was reviewed,
Speaker:was voted on. It just was not supported by the
Speaker:legislative group. There were efforts to bring it back, where
Speaker:there's a process at general conference to do that, But in the
Speaker:end, time was not our friend. And so,
Speaker:we can talk more about that at smaller gatherings, but know that you have our
Speaker:absolute support.
Speaker:There's a question about apportionments. We're gonna get to that point. Can we can we
Speaker:go up there now? Is that okay with you, Elise? Yeah. So, not to
Speaker:jump the gun, but with the annual conference apportionments being lowered to general
Speaker:conference, will Indiana local church's apportionments be lowered in the Indian annual
Speaker:conference as well? So the beautiful answer to
Speaker:that is yes. Like, that is one of the
Speaker:celebrations among many that happened at general conference
Speaker:that the general conference apportionment was
Speaker:reduced to 2.6 Excuse me. Let me make it
Speaker:make it very clear and in context. The general church
Speaker:apportionment for a period of time from 2025
Speaker:to 2020. Let me get the right numbers because I don't want because
Speaker:this is gonna be a livestream. From 2025
Speaker:to 2028, we voted on a budget of
Speaker:$373,400,000 That is what
Speaker:we voted upon as a budget. And
Speaker:the apportionment that is allocated to both annual
Speaker:conferences that does through our TIDE model,
Speaker:in the Indiana annual conference from 2025
Speaker:to 2026, the base rate is 2.6%.
Speaker:From 2027 to 2028, it will be
Speaker:2.9%, and this is a reduction from what the
Speaker:base rate was of 3.29. Here
Speaker:in Indiana, we have and hold a tithe model where we
Speaker:are asking local congregations to tithe 10%
Speaker:of your operating budget to the annual conference.
Speaker:And from that, the annual conference is able to fulfill our
Speaker:obligation as a connectional church to the
Speaker:apportionment. So there will be opportunities
Speaker:where the annual conference will be able to utilize
Speaker:the resources, the financial resources that congregations
Speaker:so faithfully offer into the general church apportionment
Speaker:and being able to retain a portion of those funds to be able
Speaker:to continue to do the work of ministry throughout
Speaker:Indiana in innovative and creative ways. So please know
Speaker:that we hear you and understand the complexities of
Speaker:I have 2 questions kind of on the same vein. Earlier, doctor Lee,
Speaker:you said that, there's currently not a way. No disfiliation
Speaker:agreement is currently available because 2553 has gone away. But there
Speaker:were, in the book of disciplines, ways for churches to close, to to
Speaker:leave, to go to different denominations. Are those still available at this point, or do
Speaker:those get removed as well? So closure and
Speaker:disaffiliation are 2 different things. And so let's be real
Speaker:clear about that. To close mean that you are discontinuing
Speaker:being a United Methodist Church or assets of your
Speaker:church becoming assets of Indiana in your conference. There
Speaker:are paragraphs 2549 to 2548
Speaker:and 2549 that still are in the book of discipline
Speaker:and relate to closures and extenuating circumstances
Speaker:that will require, far more process
Speaker:than what disaffiliation was able to hold. And so
Speaker:is there options, for closure? Absolutely. That's
Speaker:been in the book of discipline. But to be clear, closure and
Speaker:disaffiliation, those are 2 separate matters. And there are
Speaker:distinct differences related to those
Speaker:paragraphs. I believe
Speaker:there's also a a way, our process
Speaker:if you're seeking to join another denomination. To be honest, I'm not very
Speaker:familiar with that. So, I would if people
Speaker:have those kind of questions, again, I would encourage you to talk to your superintendent.
Speaker:Got it. This is a statement that was made. There was a
Speaker:on the consent calendar when the changes were made on,
Speaker:human sexuality, There was a statement made that the,
Speaker:church would not punish pastors or churches for
Speaker:not, doing LGBTQIA plus weddings. Can
Speaker:you explain kind of what that was? And was it a a portion of
Speaker:this one now? Or was it just kind of a statement that was made? C
Speaker:seen it a couple times. I don't know how people access the consent calendar. I
Speaker:think it's that they're asking here though. Is that what what was it? Because I
Speaker:think there was a statement made that said that pastors and churches who do not
Speaker:feel led to do LGBTQIA plus weddings will be protected for from any type
Speaker:of, backlash in that way from the from the United Methodist
Speaker:Church? Well, I I would I would answer that
Speaker:simply by saying the United Methodist Church seeks always to follow its own
Speaker:discipline. And so living
Speaker:within the discipline would include, the
Speaker:opportunity to do gay weddings now, but as
Speaker:we've said, there's no imposing of that on all churches.
Speaker:So I think it's it's kind of a question from earlier or a answer from
Speaker:earlier in in our in our time
Speaker:together tonight. Got it. And also
Speaker:being mindful of the sources for which you receive information.
Speaker:That that's gonna be key and essential because, Justin,
Speaker:as you just asked the question, there was never
Speaker:that language in the consent calendar related to if
Speaker:1 if a congregation or pastor chose not to,
Speaker:there was never imposition of any punishment at all. There's
Speaker:never been. So it was a protection from a
Speaker:protection from punishment is what it I read an article that
Speaker:the Indiana United Methodist Church's Facebook page posted, that
Speaker:essentially said that in the same consent calendar, that there was a statement that
Speaker:said we will protect the the right of churches. I believe it
Speaker:said to go with their conscience and context in this matter.
Speaker:So I think that's what it's asking about. The the question didn't say that directly,
Speaker:but I think that's what it's referring to because I read the same article also
Speaker:on the C Facebook page. Well, that what you just said
Speaker:is different than what you asked. Right. I think that's I think the the question
Speaker:is different there. Yeah. I think also,
Speaker:Justin, this is this is a philosophical question, I think,
Speaker:and those of you that know me, like, I know I like living in those
Speaker:moments. I think anytime you
Speaker:frame the question in terms of punishment,
Speaker:it's you've already changed the dialogue. And
Speaker:so I like to I like to think about how do we have discussions about
Speaker:discernment? How do we have discussions about faithfulness? How do we have
Speaker:discussions about moving together rather than crime and punishment?
Speaker:Because it just sets up a different dynamic. And so I'd encourage people
Speaker:to have those kinda holy conferencing conversations that that
Speaker:seek to listen really well to one another and seek to pray together before we
Speaker:talk and and during, like, the time we're talking and after we talk
Speaker:and all of that, and just kind of try to try to frame
Speaker:it in a different way. Got it.
Speaker:Elyse, there's a question about your position. You were elected to
Speaker:something. I saw I have no idea what it means. I'll be honest with you.
Speaker:I have no idea what it means, but can you explain to us in 30
Speaker:seconds what it means? And will you be leaving the IMEI? Able to
Speaker:explain in 30 seconds. More details to come, but thank you.
Speaker:Sounds good. Okay. I think
Speaker:we're about running out of time at this point. Was there anything that you
Speaker:guys wanna talk about that we did not get to? Yeah. Let me let me
Speaker:offer a couple closing thoughts, and then I'll turn it to Lise and you to
Speaker:finish. So
Speaker:it was exhausting. It was exhausting.
Speaker:It I just wanna I just wanna say we we so
Speaker:appreciate all the prayers and the text and emails of
Speaker:encouragement we got. They they they just really
Speaker:helped. And so you kinda buoyed us when when we were kinda
Speaker:sagging a little bit. And the last thing the the last thing I wanna say,
Speaker:I think it's the last thing, we'll see, is I just
Speaker:wanna thank our team. Our delegation
Speaker:was filled with people who were so incredibly faithful,
Speaker:and committed, whether they serve from annual conference
Speaker:of of 2023 or from annual conference
Speaker:of 2019. They they approached it with the same attitude
Speaker:and the same, spirit. And so I'm just really thankful
Speaker:for all the people on our delegation, and I would kinda say
Speaker:in the end, we're not done. So we still have
Speaker:jurisdictional conference in July to do, and so this team continues to
Speaker:work. And, we'll be at annual conference.
Speaker:If you see somebody you know is on the delegation, just please just tell them
Speaker:thank you. Because they've worked really hard and will continue to work
Speaker:hard through jurisdictional conference.
Speaker:And I would just echo that same thanks to our delegation. We had
Speaker:several delegation members who were chairs or vice chairs or
Speaker:subcommittee chairs of legislative groups. We had
Speaker:those that were serving as interpreters and pages and
Speaker:marshals. Indiana was well represented at this
Speaker:general conference, and for that, we are grateful. And
Speaker:also, we are still living into all of
Speaker:the decisions that this general conference, enacted.
Speaker:Please remember, there were over 650
Speaker:petitions that we acted upon as a
Speaker:church. And so considering that we just
Speaker:adjourned at 6:30 on May 3rd, which was
Speaker:just 2 days ago, to be able to provide you with
Speaker:just this point of information is a miracle in and of itself
Speaker:and for us not to be dragging as we are to
Speaker:do this. So we are grateful for you. We are grateful for all
Speaker:of our continued ministry to be able to show, share, and spread Jesus
Speaker:Christ. Pastor Justin, thank you for
Speaker:kind of, helping us over the last several months as we
Speaker:came up with this bright idea to be, informative of the annual
Speaker:conference in the know. We are grateful for our communications team
Speaker:organizing this and sending out information. This is a
Speaker:team effort, and it is simply a means of
Speaker:us ensuring that there is a place
Speaker:for you. Whoever you are, there is a place
Speaker:in Indiana for you. It doesn't matter if
Speaker:you have contextual differences or language differences
Speaker:or theological differences or orientation differences.
Speaker:There is a place for you in Indiana,
Speaker:and this is not just talk anymore, friends. We really
Speaker:mean it. Absolutely. And, Justin, thank you, Elise. And,
Speaker:Justin, I I also say thank you to you and maybe would just close my
Speaker:comments with just a little story real quick. Of course. There has to
Speaker:be. So and it's about grandkids.
Speaker:Gosh. What a what a shock.
Speaker:So general conference itself can be kind of a false environment
Speaker:that you live in for almost 2 weeks, and
Speaker:there were a couple things that kept me anchored.
Speaker:While I was at general conference, my newest
Speaker:grandchild was born. While I was at general
Speaker:conference while I was at general conference,
Speaker:somebody really dear to me got sick and went in the hospital.
Speaker:While I was at general conference, while we were all at general
Speaker:conference, 3 police officers were shot and killed
Speaker:in Charlotte. Why is that
Speaker:important to share? Because we can get so wrapped
Speaker:up in the workings and the decisions at general conference that we
Speaker:forget that we serve a hurting world on behalf of Jesus
Speaker:Christ. And that hurting world continued while we were in
Speaker:a in a convention center. That hurting world continues while we have
Speaker:discussions. And so let us not allow our
Speaker:our gaze to be diverted
Speaker:from our Lord and savior, because that's what
Speaker:we need to focus on. That's who we need to talk about. That's what we
Speaker:need to share together. And under the arms of Christ, there is room for all
Speaker:in The United Methodist Church as well. Thank you so much,
Speaker:Justin. Thank you, Elise, for, for your comments as well.
Speaker:Will you close us in prayer?
Speaker:Absolutely. I was just making sure that was to me. Yeah. Make sure It's
Speaker:like, I didn't like that look. It's like, as you're preaching the bible, I guess.
Speaker:Still working? So let's do let's
Speaker:pray together, friends. Gracious god, we just thank you so much for
Speaker:who you are and for the joy you bring to each of our lives even
Speaker:in the midst of hard things. We thank you, God, for grace,
Speaker:a grace that covers all, a grace that includes all, a grace that saves
Speaker:all. We pray, oh, lord, that as we receive that grace, it would
Speaker:so inspire us that we would be ready to run into the
Speaker:streets and even amongst our family
Speaker:to share the good news that you have
Speaker:loved the world so much that you sent your only son to be our savior,
Speaker:and that in him we find life, we
Speaker:find a way of life, abundant life, and eternal
Speaker:life. Therefore, oh god, through your spirit, send us into the world
Speaker:to be your people, to be your witnesses that all
Speaker:might know. In the name of Christ, we pray.
Speaker:Amen. Amen. So friends, for those of you
Speaker:alive, thank you for being here on Facebook and here in the webinar. Noah's gonna
Speaker:go ahead and turn those things off. So if you
Speaker:you ain't gotta go home, but you can't stay here, and hope the rest of
Speaker:your day is, is filled with joy and grace. Take it
Speaker:away, Noah. Thank you, everyone. Thank you.
